tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8243351006478134285.post6273492256492461278..comments2024-03-20T12:34:55.100-05:00Comments on Stonekettle Station: An Eye For An Eye In The Country Of The BlindJim Wrighthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11259550121437562338noreply@blogger.comBlogger78125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8243351006478134285.post-80096622800838281052017-07-23T17:12:22.733-05:002017-07-23T17:12:22.733-05:00Your analysis is flawed and for that reason your c...Your analysis is flawed and for that reason your conclusion is flawed as well.<br />Israel gives to the US much more than the oil rich Arab countries.<br />In fact, in the Nasdaq Israeli companies are the third most listed after China, all foreign aid comes back to the US as buybacks, the US military uses a lot of technology and intelligence from Israel.<br /><br />Today Islam is the world's security nightmare. You just need to look at Nice, Paris, London, Manchester, Brussels and a few cities in Sweden and Germany to understand why.<br /><br />Now for the flawed analysis of the problem - just visiting a country and speaking with a few people does not give you a full insight. The reason there is no peace between Israel and the Palestinians is very deep.<br />The PLO (Palestinian Liberation Organization) was founded in 1965, two years before the 67 "occupation". So it is clear that the Palestinians will not have less than everything. PLO in Arabic is Fatah (acronym for Falastine Thrir Hizb) however it is also a unique word from the Koran that is served only in the context of taking Muslim lands that have fallen in battle.<br /><br />So Yasser Arafat that was born in Cairo in 1927 can claim the Jewish quarter of the old city of Jerusalem when my Grandparents were born about 20 years before him.<br /><br />Now if you look at your conclusion - let us leave the Middle East and let one side (hopefully the Arab Muslims) win, what will be the consequence?<br />Today the "Palestinians" that live in the West Bank (Jeudea and Samaria) have access to Israeli hospitals, their life expectancy is higher than that of Brazil, their infant mortality is lower than that of Brazil. They have the best conditions out of Arab Muslims living in non Gulf countries. <br /><br />What would their lives be under total Muslim rule? Check 56 Muslim majority countries and see. Check Gaza and their "tolerance" to women, gays, Christians, and God forbid Ba'hai or Druze. <br /><br />There is a reason why Muslim Arabs are killing Muslim Arabs in Iraq, Syria, Yemen, Libya, Algeria, Sudan by the millions (!) and it is not imperialism and colonialism - do you know why? because these wars have been going on forever.<br /><br />So as a member of the free world you can either support the only democracy that is certainly not perfect or go with the Islamization and hope they would forget about you. But they won't.<br /><br />Now last but not least - in the second century AD their were discussions in the North of Israel (Saffed) about "An eye for an eye" - the conclusion was that there should be a monetary compensation. Do you know what was their logic? That if a person is already blind, taking out his eyes won't matter. So the death penalty was cancelled and the eye and tooth was cancelled. Too bad Islam is not yet at that stage.<br />Rafihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10764047759228171592noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8243351006478134285.post-74846378426210129502014-10-21T20:55:28.661-05:002014-10-21T20:55:28.661-05:00Sad, Anon, and shamefully true. Even creepier IMO ...Sad, Anon, and shamefully true. Even creepier IMO is the almost Aryan-like ethnic purity test that American Jewish people give to suspected "others." I converted to Judaism when I was a very young woman, a decision I do not regret BTW, but I often faced scrutiny by other synagogue attendees to whom I introduced myself with my decidedly goyish last name. If I didn't GIVE my last name, my fellow congregants would pressure me for it, and then look down their noses at me for my non-Jewish last name. I really didn't give a shit personally; I'd been through the two-year long conversion process and was just as Jewish as they were, but the overall implications of someone not being accepted into "the tribe" due to a fucking surname is downright scary.Everyone and Their Bloggerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12226555758811435275noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8243351006478134285.post-33081403294933736892014-10-21T20:22:02.233-05:002014-10-21T20:22:02.233-05:00Three words: Military Industrial Complex. The U.S....Three words: Military Industrial Complex. The U.S. no-bid contractors can't live without their constant cash cow, ERM, mortal enemies in the ME, so what better excuse to keep up the war machine than to keep clinging to the perfect excuse that is "we have no GREATER FRIEND than!" Israel.Everyone and Their Bloggerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12226555758811435275noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8243351006478134285.post-78926724614166692732014-10-21T20:18:12.117-05:002014-10-21T20:18:12.117-05:00Same. I love Miko Peled (another pro-Palestinian J...Same. I love Miko Peled (another pro-Palestinian Jewish person and Israeli) but disagree with him that a single state Israel/Palestine is the only viable solution. If I were PM over there, I'd have no problem at all going back to the 1947 borders and an independent Palestinian state alongside an independent Israel. I'm not at all a Zionist, but I am pragmatic enough to realize that, somewhere down the line, the Israelis just have to stay on that side of the tape and the Palestinians on this side. I hate to be patronizing but it really is a case where the UN should send them to opposite sides of the room and tell them to LEAVE each other TF alone.Everyone and Their Bloggerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12226555758811435275noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8243351006478134285.post-4095879764814421792014-08-04T12:45:30.794-05:002014-08-04T12:45:30.794-05:00Woloz, the main reason for American support of Isr...Woloz, the main reason for American support of Israel is racism. If Israel falls, there will be a massive refugee crisis akin to the one in 1946-1947 in Europe, and unlike 1946-1947, there's no obvious place to send the Jewish refugees, so the United States would end up having to accept them. President Truman forced the British to allow the State of Israel not because Truman liked Jews, but, rather, Truman would rather have the Jews over there rather than here due to widespread racism against Jews in the United States. That reasoning still applies even though racism against Jews has died down significantly in the US. <br /><br />As for the reason the US would have to accept the refugees, it's because the US allowed the Holocaust by not serving as a place of refuge for Europe's unwanted Jews. Eichmann offered to let Europe's Jews be sent to the US rather than exterminated. The US refused. Thus Eichmann's "Final Solution". That moral stain still lingers, even if the US has written it out of its public consciousness.BadTuxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01345749557330760251noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8243351006478134285.post-16550130820113539232014-08-04T12:35:15.995-05:002014-08-04T12:35:15.995-05:00Question for Tristan and Jim re: Why does the US p...Question for Tristan and Jim re: Why does the US provide so much support for Israel? The old answers: birthplace of Christianity, only democracy in the ME, etc just don't cut it anymore. Moreover, the popular answers from Israel's critics (powerful Jewish lobby and military industry) also feel flimsy. I may be reaching, but is the US providing so much financial assistance to prevent another superpower (China?) from becoming Israel's benefactor? I am a Zionist who opposes the building of Jewish settlements in the West Bank. I've always felt that within Israel, the Haredi vote was politically less significant than jeopardizing US financial aid. But if the Israeli's financial aid all can just as easily come from China, the US commitment starts to make a lot more sense. Any thoughts?Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05463776157653823403noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8243351006478134285.post-77035744211368777962014-08-04T12:03:30.954-05:002014-08-04T12:03:30.954-05:00Jim, I suspect that Israel legitimately made diffi...Jim, I suspect that Israel legitimately made difficult concessions to create peace when they evicted Jews from Gaza in 2005 and left homes, infrastructure and 3,000 functioning greenhouses for Gazans. The US even helped Gaza to hold free elections, and persuaded Gazans to elect a party seeking peace and prosperity. Instead, Gazans took this historic opportunity to change their lot in life, and elected a party whose raison d'etre is to destroy Israel and kill all Jews. The rest is a very sad history. <br /><br />Anon, Israel has the military might to kill every Gazan within an hour. It is tragic that 1,800 Gazans (or 0.1% of the population) were killed in Israel's campaign to disarm Hamas. But let's be honest with ourselves, Israel does not want to kill civilian Gazans, both to avoid bad PR and for moral reasons. <br /><br />Former Israeli PM Golda Meir (in)famously stated that she can forgive Israel's enemies for killing Israel's children, but she can never forgive them for forcing Israel to kill their children. <br /><br />Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05463776157653823403noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8243351006478134285.post-73679628623560608982014-08-04T01:13:35.260-05:002014-08-04T01:13:35.260-05:00I can't tell you how many times I've linke...I can't tell you how many times I've linked this blogpost in Facebook. My newsfeed is awash in pro Israel and pro Palestinian posts. My inner liberal troll loves it, because I get to tell BOTH SIDES how full of shit they are. <br /><br />You can't fix stupid. (well, you can if it's a cat)Jeff Cooperhttps://www.facebook.com/jeffrey.cooper.9883noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8243351006478134285.post-39982346026466398772014-07-28T08:41:44.117-05:002014-07-28T08:41:44.117-05:00My final notes on this, rerun from another blog: &...My final notes on this, rerun from another blog: "In a better world, the USA would use its considerable leverage to restrain Israeli conduct and lobby the UN to intervene. As it is, there seems no political advantage in the USA to doing so and several of the Security Council’s permanent members would probably block action in the UN. So the war goes on."Raven Onthillhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06634556869209594389noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8243351006478134285.post-39650071693597094712014-07-23T14:07:10.999-05:002014-07-23T14:07:10.999-05:00Another great one Jim.
Here's a couple lines o...Another great one Jim.<br />Here's a couple lines out of George Washington's Farewell Address in 1796 that seem to mirror yours:<br /><br />"Excessive partiality for one foreign nation and excessive dislike of another cause those whom they actuate to see danger only on one side, and serve to veil and even second the arts of influence on the other. Real patriots who may resist the intrigues of the favorite are liable to become suspected and odious, while its tools and dupes usurp the applause and confidence of the people, to surrender their interests."<br /><br />"So likewise, a passionate attachment of one nation for another produces a variety of evils. Sympathy for the favorite nation, facilitating the illusion of an imaginary common interest in cases where no real common interest exists, and infusing into one the enmities of the other, betrays the former into a participation in the quarrels and wars of the latter without adequate inducement or justification."<br /><br />And here is the one you didn't state exactly but runs though out your essay:<br /><br />"The nation which indulges towards another a habitual hatred or a habitual fondness is in some degree a slave. It is a slave to its animosity or to its affection, either of which is sufficient to lead it astray from its duty and its interest." <br /><br />You're in good company. I think old George would have approved.frog33https://www.blogger.com/profile/06824550346184447508noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8243351006478134285.post-12983292356108454122014-07-22T19:37:58.797-05:002014-07-22T19:37:58.797-05:00Fuck em all, Let God (Which doesn't exist) sor...Fuck em all, Let God (Which doesn't exist) sort them out. I'm fed up with all of em.<br /><br />Jeff Lamm, AO3, USS Forrestal, CV-59, Spc4, MPI, US Army.Cthulhunoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8243351006478134285.post-42443264358027154562014-07-21T10:58:45.301-05:002014-07-21T10:58:45.301-05:00According to Israeli historian Itzhak Galnoor (ple...According to Israeli historian Itzhak Galnoor (please note that I'm using *ISRAELI* sources for the vast majority of my numbers), the Muslim population was 725,507 in 1922, 880,746 in 1931 and 1,339,763 in 1946 of which Galnoor estimates 100,000 were external illegal immigrants. Most other sources say even that is an overestimate of the number of number of Muslim illegal immigrants to Palestine. In short, the Muslim population increase was 54%, not 150%, and even Israeli historians admit that the majority of that was births due to modern medicine coming to Palestine with the British. Next lie, please?BadTuxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01345749557330760251noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8243351006478134285.post-54575906121897432742014-07-21T10:04:31.735-05:002014-07-21T10:04:31.735-05:00You neglected to mention that the Palestinian popu...You neglected to mention that the Palestinian population between 1920 and 1940 went UP by 150%. Palestinians from other countries moved back to Palestine because the Jews created economic opportunities previously nonexistent.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8243351006478134285.post-57807755295462878212014-07-21T09:38:34.711-05:002014-07-21T09:38:34.711-05:00It doesn't matter if they legitimately bought ...It doesn't matter if they legitimately bought the land or not. One does not simply walk into a country, buy land, and declare that they are now their own country. Every billionaire in the world would have their own country.Hethrownoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8243351006478134285.post-76972406511396420742014-07-20T19:45:45.862-05:002014-07-20T19:45:45.862-05:00There's the other answer: think about how many...There's the other answer: think about how many leaders who brought peace and freedom have been assassinated: Lincoln, Gandhi, MLK, Rabin…<br /><br />Part of the answer to the question seems to be that to win peace, people have to be willing to die, not gloriously in battle, but ignominiously by the assassin's bullet, or the terrorist's bomb.<br /><br />Takes a lot of guts to be a pacifist.Raven Onthillhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06634556869209594389noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8243351006478134285.post-26181045094781707002014-07-20T17:55:10.113-05:002014-07-20T17:55:10.113-05:00I've got no dog in this hunt, but I've lon...I've got no dog in this hunt, but I've long felt that the Zionists have embodied the same hatred and focus on genocide of those they despise that Hitler directed at them. I see them as no better than he was. A shame really, since as a people, I would have thought they would never want that attitude propagated. Instead, they have become the same oppressor who oppressed and murdered their families.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8243351006478134285.post-23840928059732506912014-07-20T14:40:20.249-05:002014-07-20T14:40:20.249-05:00Amen, brother. I was going to suggest just nuking ...Amen, brother. I was going to suggest just nuking Jerusalem and the surrounding area, but your plan is much more thorough. :-)<br /><br />-Paul Cooper (Former QM3/SS)<br />pecooperhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07808659105665044897noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8243351006478134285.post-62930383490243984042014-07-20T14:17:15.806-05:002014-07-20T14:17:15.806-05:00I had a friend who was the son of medical missiona...I had a friend who was the son of medical missionaries sent to the Gaza Strip. He told me about once, when he was a young teenager, when wounded Palestinians were brought into the clinic after a raid by the Israeli army. There was a little girl, maybe 10 years old, who had been shot an stabbed in the stomach, and the clinic, by then, had run out of pain killers to administer.<br /><br />She told him that the Israelis had broken into their house looking for her mother's uncle. Her mother didn't know where he was. Neither did her father or her brothers. The soldiers didn't believe them, and executed her parents and her eldest brother. She tried to stop them, so the shot her in the belly.<br /><br />A 10 year old girl. Shot in the belly. Left to die. No pain-killers. All he could do was hold her and try to comfort her and listen to her cry and tell her story over and over until she died.<br /><br />He never had anything good to say about Israel.<br /><br />I can understand why people take sides.<br /><br />-Paul Cooper (Former QM3/SS)<br />pecooperhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07808659105665044897noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8243351006478134285.post-40314244669640846912014-07-20T12:29:08.282-05:002014-07-20T12:29:08.282-05:00If you think that's crazy, google the USS Star...If you think that's crazy, google the USS Stark.<br /><br />Graeme Sutton, Victoria BCAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8243351006478134285.post-38427892337655491362014-07-20T12:00:56.268-05:002014-07-20T12:00:56.268-05:00BadTux, I agree, extremists have a vested interest...BadTux, I agree, extremists have a vested interest in the bloodshed. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8243351006478134285.post-51342592246224590162014-07-20T11:58:25.460-05:002014-07-20T11:58:25.460-05:00I agree with your post. Most wars are about “what ...I agree with your post. Most wars are about “what is mine vs. what is yours” whether it be religion or resources. Humans when confronted with conflicts involving resources usually have to compromise to live peacefully. Unfortunately, religion is usually the sticking point that sets off the shit storm. I vote with Lennon. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8243351006478134285.post-50677441846704958762014-07-20T11:54:37.157-05:002014-07-20T11:54:37.157-05:00That was not one of Heinlein's better moments,...That was not one of Heinlein's better moments, I'm afraid. Buddhists have at times supported wars and are currently participating in a civil war in Myanmar.Raven Onthillhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06634556869209594389noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8243351006478134285.post-63210654245929454212014-07-20T11:45:12.159-05:002014-07-20T11:45:12.159-05:00If we cared about Israel and Palestine we might le...If we cared about Israel and Palestine we might learn something about our own radical right.<br /><br />In 1992, the Israel public was interested enough in peace to elect a Labor government which signed the Oslo Accords in 1993 and 1995 and recognized the Palestinian Liberation Organization. And the Labor leader, Prime Minister Yitzhak Rabin, was assassinated by an Israeli radical-rightist in 1995, the radical-right Likud Party returned to power, and so it is has been ever since.<br /><br />It is harder to tell how matters stood on the Palestinian side. Since the Palestinians are stateless they cannot form a legitimate government, so it is not clear how much popular support the PLO ever had, but at least the PLO was willing to sign the Oslo Accords.<br /><br />People in the region who care enough about peace to compromise have been shot by people who want the war to continue. Now, where have I heard something like that before?<br /><br />This also gives us something to do in the region, if we want: support the factions that support peace. But our own war-mongering factions have formed an alliance with their war-mongering factions. And, of course, the factions that want peace might not keep the oil flowing.Raven Onthillhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06634556869209594389noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8243351006478134285.post-12812619509713588432014-07-20T10:48:32.079-05:002014-07-20T10:48:32.079-05:00"How dumb are Hamas to keep firing rockets at..."How dumb are Hamas to keep firing rockets at Israel and starting / continuing this fight knowing what will happen?"<br /><br />Hamas is only 'dumb' if it isn't getting what it sets out to get by firing the missiles. But what Hamas wants is the same thing Netanyahu wants: war without end. Netanyahu wants war so he can remain in power and funds and prestige, and Hamas wants war so it can remain in power and funds and prestige. Win win for both of them. Only losers are everyone else. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8243351006478134285.post-77324393204720463002014-07-20T10:35:52.856-05:002014-07-20T10:35:52.856-05:00I'm with both of you. Time to move forward int...I'm with both of you. Time to move forward into this century and use new types of power available in our own country. Stop supporting these Middle East countries all because of our forced dependency on oil led by Cheney et al. It would be great to not only be free of the ME oil but also to marginalize all these oil barons in the US. They don't need any more money, dollars, or power. Time to be self-sufficient again.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com